cities. Professor Paton says it is important any decisions made in the wake of the current devastating bushfires are made after “careful technical analysis” is completed. But he concedes “there are circumstances in which no amount of preparedness is going to make any difference”. Fatalistic approach Professor Paton says one of the main inhibitions in people preparing for the bushfire season is in whether they believe their actions will be effective. “The biggest constraint is these …
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I find it fascinating that people can criticise the proposal of fire bunkers.
The policy is “leave early or stay and defend”.
For those who stay, what is plan B if you lose the fight? A wombat hole is better than nothing!
You don’t go down with the ship because there isn’t an Australian Standards life jacket available.
Good design and standards are to be highly encouraged, but to stay and fight without any kind of shelter is madness.
Sorry, I got carried away and felt I had to jump on the bandwagon somehow. Obviously jumped on the wrong side of it… LOL!
The idea would be to build the bunker close enough to the house to accss easily, but far enough away to prevent the problems I have sketched earlier (falling rubble etc).
The question of when/how do you get to the bunker is an important one, and would depend on your strategy. If you plan to stay inside the house until the last moment, then probably an entrance from the house should be provided, along with another that would not be blocked by falling rubble etc.
It is definitely possible to build a bunker that would basically guarantee a 100% chance of survival. Your chances in a bunker, that is specifically designed to provide a survivable atmosphere during an extreme fire, are difinitely higher than in a house (no matter how well built or protected) that is designed for comfort, a view, entertainment, breezes, winter sun, security etc etc. The point is that a house is expected to fulfil many functions. It is a compromise at best.
Obviously, it all has to start with WHERE do you build a house in the first place. Then how to design a more fire-proof house. Then, what you can do generally during the fire season to prepare. Then what you can do when you know a fire is coming.
All of these things must be done. If they are done properly, the chances of the house going are significantly reduced. But if you realise the house is going to go, a bunker could save your family.
To soon, dude.
Bear in mind that some of the people watching this video would have been personally involved. They are probably not going to find your comment funny.
My emotion is also anger. You may kill more people by this thatn you save.
A well designed, and prepared house, does provide protection. Proven by research. I’ve been to Kinglake since the fires. I live nearby.
When/how are you going to get to the bunker? How are you going to get out?
The leave or stay policy is a good policy. Trouble is that it is not understood. ‘Leave’ means leave early in the morning BEFORE there is a fire. A fear that a bunker will give false safety and kill more people.
I wouldn’t put myself in their shoes, because ya feet would be burnt off… LOL!
Absolutely. The first step in community preparedness has to be about reducing the risk to existing structures. There are many ways to reduce the risks, some of which are cheap and simple to implement. The most powerful weapon is knowledge. One would like to see the media getting more involved in the “boring” business of getting the information out there, instead of descending like vultures when tragedy strikes.
Bunkers are a last resort, and should not replace basic preparedness as a strategy.
The question of poorly-constructed bunkers is exactly what I am trying to address. I am convinced that it is possible to design a fire-proof bunker that will withstand a 1,000 degree fire event.
The reason that I am so confident is that I have already designed and tested something that works. But I am sure that mine is not the best possible design.
I was hoping that more people would get involved in this, to swap out ideas and refine the design.
But will post my version. And show it works.
I think the trick would be to go underground. Earth is an enormously good insulator. I have made a video, which I must still post, of me aiming a blowtorch at my hand, which is covered by a thin layer of soil. Even a few inches of soil is enough to prevent the transfer of heat, so that I can keep my hand there almost indefinitely without discomfort.
The other consideration would then be ventilation, but I think that is a soluble problem, given that one only needs about half an hour of oxygen.
good thinking though mate,m but we need to read and understand more about reducing community vulnerability by telling them and the bloody media to start showing information on property protection.
if you wonder how i know, its because i was there I saw and heard things that concur with what you said about extreme conditions and the concept of buildings not being able to with stand the impact of the fire. There are no standards, because even the most (bomb proof) bunker, or building still failed in a fire that is driven by a weather event of this magnitude. I need to let you know that there was considerable evidence that many steel structures that failed at temps over 1000C.
Rob, thanks for the thoughts.
sorry but a competition may not be the answer to this problem, its a very complex problem. the deaths were unneccessary given that there were so many in poorly constructed bunkers.
I agree.
wonderful
hey Rob, great ideas mate ;]
shared
Dude!
We’re talking about saving lives in bushfires. That’s what this conversation is about. You seem to be having a completely different conversation.
ALL BY YOURSELF.
If you keep that up, people will start pointing and whispering. Then eventually that white van with the padded interior will arrive to take you away.
Seriously. The trick to joining a conversation is to follow the thread, then contribute something new. Barging in and mumbling obscenities isn’t the way to go.
Good luck.
Not quite there are you sunshine, don’t play dumb with me cunt..
Huh?
You have heaps wierd eyes, one would think you are from ET. I like the concept of utilizing the power of the internet to captivate many viewers with the power of your eyes, im sure it works with many of your viewers. But not me. Keep it up.
Thanks.
Your comments always make me smile.
Ja, it’s frustrating for me to see such suffering and being so far away. I have friends over there. Felt like jumping on a ‘plane and flying over to volunteer fight fires, but that’s obviously not practical.
This project was the best contribution I could think of (along with sending some money over for the relief effort).
Thanks, Jen.
I am particularly interested in getting schools involved in this project, entering the competition as a science project, that sort of thing. So if you know any schoolkids who could get their teachers involved, that’d be great.
Also, still looking for corporate sponsors. I don’t mind sponsoring a prize, but our currency is weak at the mo. For the project to really take off, we’ll need a BIG prize, like $100,000 or maybe even a million.
THAT would get people thinking of solutions.
The CFA did an amazing job, under the circumstances. The fact that most firefighters are volunteers makes it even more commendable.
As I said to tubester, every family who’s safe in a bunker is one less family that needs to be rescued by firefighters, who put their own lives on the line each time. Imagine a situation where you approach a house and there is some sort of sign to say: “Don’t worry, we’re fine. Go where you’re more needed.” It would help the firefighters, too.
Let’s design it !
For many of the existing houses, the cost of retro-fitting them to make them fire-safe would be sugnificantly more expensive than the cost of a bunker.
If it were possible to design an affordable bunker that was tested and CERTIFIED to be effective, it could simly be another option open to people and many would probably choose VOLUNTARILY to install one on their properties.
Every family protected by a safe bunker is one less family that has to be rescued by firefighters.